There are none of those questions because the media was complicit in allowing Bush to get away with all of his garbage because they can't do their jobs.

The swine media is doing its best to make the Democratic Party and President Obama culpable in other the previous administration's misdeeds.

It's not too hard to figure out.

How many times have you heard the "Obama's doing something just like Bush did" this week alone?

The swine have been doing this since 1/21/09, when it isn't trying to attach idiotic scandals to the man.

There are not enough negative words in the dictionary to describe how I view the swine that pass for the fourth estate at this point.

On the Joke of the Morning Chrystia Freeland said that exact thing. Her statement from Media Matters:

Chrystia Freeland: "Making Nancy Pelosi into the big culprit of waterboarding is to move the spotlight to the wrong place"

Of course, had she come out at the time, the same people who are calling her a flip-flopper now would've called her a traitor then.

Yep, but that doesn't count... Of course, Joke and Mark Halperin, Mika the Liberal...lol, and Willie all tried to shout Chrystia down when she was saying this, but she just kept going.

I don't understand this whole situation. Why are people mad at Nancy Pelosi for knowing about torture, but not mad at the Bush administration for doing the torturing?

This is like me telling my girlfriend's best friend that I'm banging over chicks and swearing her to secrecy. Then having my girlfriend find pictures, text messages, and video tapes of me banging other chicks and instead of going after me, she goes after her best friend for not telling her about me banging other chicks.

It's exactly that, Bob, a distraction from the initial point of what they should be covering. It also sells. The CIA is a department with no face. Scandal loves a face, and if they can connect a little, grandmotherly type like Pelosi to torture it sells papers. What are they going to do, post a picture of the CIA entrance next to the type? Have the CIA logo over the talking heads' shoulders while they try to blame torture on a department instead of someone in the VP's office? Doesn't Pelosi's face over that pundit's shoulder look more scandalous?

Wow. After I posted my comment, my very next click brought me to this. See what I mean?

One way or another and I don't pretend to have a solution, is Obama needs to get a handle on this.

All we see is the rethugs and rethug pundits out in front of this. I haven't seen many dems, except for Pelosi (and we see how THATS working out).

I still can't believe we are having a national conversation on torture.
How far we have fallen in the last 8 years.
wow

Remember that Al Franken line from his radio show? "Brought to you by the Republican coalition to distract you from real issues."

Why are we not hearing about Republicans who were in the room with Pelosi getting the same briefing from the same sources? Was she in the room by herself? She says they essentially lied to the congress, not to her personally. Followup, pleeeeeze.

Obama needs to get a handle on this? Uh huh.

He was pretty clear during his campaign that if we want change we have to MAKE him.

So the best way to get a handle on this is lean on Congress and Obama. It's We the people, in order to create a more perfect union..."

It's not We the Administration, nor We the Congress of Asinine Scum Found Under Rocks with a little bit smegma smeared on them. It's We The People.

I think Obama dies a little more each day We The People don't do anything to take back the power that was clearly invested in us. It's Hamilton vs. Adams and always has been.

Where is the attention? Really, how many articles have we had on Bush screwing up the war, fabricating the case for the war. I think we've seen so much of it, were numb to it.

Pelosi lied, therefore it's news. It's hypocrisy in it's simplist form. Now, it would be easy just to quote some dumb thing a republican said, and to point out a liar, but thats not the point here, she lied, straight out, and now has to explain herself.

Jan, I disagree. This needs to play out and when the truth comes out, it is what it is. If the CIA is wrong, then investigations will take place. If Pelosi is wrong, then investigations will take place. I'm not a Pelosi fan, but she is the one calling for a truth commission and asking that the CIA release the data to find out the truth. That helps her argument.

If Obama steps into the middle of it, it'll just be more fodder about him backing away from transparency. It becomes partisan. Let the Republicans argue for torture. Former Intel Committee Chair Sen. Bob Graham has come out in agreement with Pelosi. So this needs to play out and the more it does, the more comes to light about possible crimes during the Bush years.

Mike, she lied? Prove it.

Latest MSNBC Chyron: "OBAMA = BUSH on TORTURE?" The Liberal media at work.

Thats why were looking into it. Ok, here, her statements made were contradictory. Keep in mind, you are taking Pelosi's side here.

CitizenJ -

Actually they do their job quite well once you understand that their job is to disseminate the propaganda of the corporatists that run our country. They war is what that cabal wanted so the media ignored stories that did not support going to war. An investigation of the malfeasance of the Bush administration would reveal the depth of the rabbit hole our government has become.

They have done exactly what they are paid to do. Look at who pays them. Follow the money and all becomes clear. Look at how much money was poured into Halliburton, KBR, and Blackwater and we haven't even mentioned Lockheed-Martin or NorthrupGrummen.

We were robbed by a corporate cabal and the BushCo criminal conspiracy were simply the pawns that enabled it. Anyone not recognizing this is just ignoring the facts staring them right in the face. It's as plain as day.

she lied, straight out, and now has to explain herself

Actually, all indications are that she DIDN'T lie, but if the media & the GOP say it enough, people will accept it as so...'cause some people still accept everything that the media & GOP say as true, even tho their track records suck dead pygmies in hell.

The cover letter accompanying the docs (which everyone points to as proof of Pelosi's lies) indicates fairly clearly that the CIA could not determine the veracity of the docs!

suppose I say that I told Cesca I'd murdered someone. Bob says not so - that never happened. My lawyer then produces a doc written sometime after the fact in which I say that I told Cesca about the murder, and my lawyer says that he can't verify if what's in the doc is true. Who, then, is the liar? Me? or Bob?
For some of you the answer is obvious - it's Bob who is lying & he must somehow find something which will prove the negative - that he was never told what I claimed I told him.
In the meantime, there's a dead body out there somewhere...

Regardless of being a democrat or republican, this is all the more reason there should be an investigation. If she's telling the truth then she's fine.

Exactly, Alex. But all this can be done with if we cut to the chase and the CIA releases the documents. Why won't they release them? If she's guilty, then fry her too. I don't care. But you can't call her a liar because you believe that the CIA is a bastion of truth.

Mike, PELOSI is the one asking for an investigation. Doesn't that say anything to you?

But you can't call her a liar because you believe that the CIA is a bastion of truth.

technically, you can. But it would be stupid.

It's the investigation that we want. Investigate, Investigate, Investigate. Please start the investigation now. Nancy says she welcomes an investigation.

Watch which group of liars screams NO! if we try to start an investigation. It won't be Pelosi and I.

Some people are either ridiculously easy to district with shiny Grandmas, or are co-conspirators.

This Pelosi business is an obvious smoke screen distraction to hide the real story which is that we invaded a country on completely fabricated pretense. The War Criminal brigade was led by Rumsfeld and Cheney, not Nancy Pelosi. Ignore the obvious diversion. Doucheborough is a fully complicit propaganda dispenser as are Lush Rimjob and BillO the Clown.

If Roxana Saberi had been waterboarded (tortured, whatever) by the Iranians to have her "admit" to being an American spy, would we have so many right-wing bloggers and windbags talking about how this stuff works?

SillyGit,

You've hit the nail on the head! Now, if you can say that to all your friends without using teh crazy words, and keep repeating it, you can at least force your corner of the world to focus on the center of the issue, rather than the fringes.

Here's what I see in the media, and bloggyland. I see one side use crazy language to bash and blame the other. In response, the other side bashes and blames the first, using similar words. What we have here isn't so much a failure to communicate, but a failure to communicate INTELLIGENTLY.

Most Americans KNOW the truth is somewhere in the middle. So, then, it's a race to the middle; the first side to get there wins. Or, we just keep pouring on teh Crazy, the farthest extremes of each respective side, and NOTHING gets solved.

This type of fight is a battle of attrition. Liberals cannot win that kind of battle right now; you can't even afford to be in it much less win it.

The solution is to turn this over to the UN, and let them deal with it. If President Obama wants any time or capital left to bring change to America, he must do that as fast as he can. Or, we can just keep going 'round in circles.

I tend to agree with the latter part of PPP's message.

However, I would say that there's a reason why the discussion on these matters involving torture devolve into idiocy. It is obvious that one side is being deliberately inquisitive for specific purposes, while another is being deliberately asinine for much of the same. The question is who does the silliness benefit more: the inquisitive or the asinine.

Bob, your title for this article is perfect.

TrebleP, A major problem I see with the UN option is it plays right into the wingnuts' "Teh liberals want to give away your 'Merkin sovereignty" psycho-babble.

The UN, in general, is a good idea poorly executed.

brutlyhonest - spot on.

If we do not handle this ourselves I will have to listen to Lush Rimjob and the dittoheads yell and scream about the evil U.N. violating U.S. sovereignty until hell freezes over. I basically agree with PPP except for his solution.

There is no reason to call in the U.N. and every reason not to. The EIT was illegal under our own laws. We do not need to use treaties or international law to prosecute.