I knew that somehow. Out of respect for you, I will not ramble here. I've spun myself out on Facebook already.

QT

I'm with you. I think it's sad, and with Farrah Fawcett's death I feel like it's the passing of an era of sorts, but I wasn't particularly a fan. James Doohan's death hit me a lot harder than this did.

One question - are we going to have topical open threads from now on, or is the PTT dead for good?

I have the sense that we are focussed and campaigning for health care, so no PTT, but a few people are asking on FB

QT

Mostly I'm annoyed that MSNBC last night= Keith doing the usual cable news lets-stay-on-this-for-hours-despite-our-lack-of-information-to-report. I feel like Rachel wanted no part of it- like how she always makes Kent Jones do her NBC plugs for her.
And not to be rude to fans of either, but the death of two entertainers just shouldn't garner this much coverage. Hey, news media... How many people died in Iran yesterday? How many people died yesterday because of our clusterfuck of a healthcare system?

I enjoyed his music in the 80s. Billy Jean saved the music industry, so I was told back then. Loved that song. Unfortunately, he grew into a pathetic figure the last 20 years of his life.

I regret that we're going to be force-fed MJ news 24-7 all summer, when there are important issues like health care for Americans to deal with. (I bet Gov. Sanford is kicking himself for not coming back from his trip a few days later. No one may have noticed.)

In my case, a part of my childhood died yesterday. I was in grade school when the Jackson 5 hit the big time, and this third-grader cranked up the radio when their songs came on. Like many middle school boys at the time, I masturbated to that Farrah Fawcett poster (TMI?) and stayed up late to catch her on TV (despite the awfulness of the show itself), and like all college students at the time, I was blown away by Jackson's debut of the moon walk on the Motown special.

Fawcett 's illness was real, and of course, we feel nothing but compassion for her. But Jackson suffered from a kind of sickness too, and in a weird way, his death can be seen as an end to his suffering as well. I feel compassion for them both.

Anyway, those childhood memories are suddenly a lot more distant than they were the day before yesterday.

Indeed Mystico. A friend of mine once did a report in school about the Challenger disaster, putting the story on one side of a page and that day's obits on the other, pretty much saying "What's the big deal? People die every day."

Again, it's sad, especially if the reports of him being injected with god knows what right before he died turn out to be true, but I think we're reaching the end of America's obsession with Deaths of Icons. With so much coverage possible, everyone is just getting tired of the saturation and media generated public spectacle of it all. It's become so completely impersonal. You almost feel forced into mourning, forced into regarding the dead icon as, well, iconic, pioneering and sometimes "heroic" (*horf*). It gets packaged, marketed and forced down our throats.

At the risk of being booed off this thread, I'm sharing this link with the class...and then I'm ducking for cover.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SdU3NI1fVbQ

I always sort of thought he was weird, but then again, I think most entertainers are a little weird. He just never had my attention, that's all.

Beyond that, I have this to say:

Just how two-faced is the media going to be, and how long are we going to let them get away with it?

Suddenly, Michael Jackson is a hero again, after being a media ghoul for years. The media treated this man mercilessly, and now they want us to believe that they loved him?

I call bullshit.

Same thing happened with Anna Nicole Smith, who was basically a joke to the media, until she died, and out of nowhere, she was "the next Marilyn Monroe".

Who else? Who else has the media done this to?

They are shameless.

Kudos to you, Bob, for being honest.

You know why they are being two-faced, PPP. Whatever sensationality generates a story, no matter how truly newsworthy, is what they will grab on to. MJ sells a billion albums? News! King of Pop! Next! MJ sells only a million albums? News! Has the King of Pop lost his throne? Next! MJ gets accused of child molestation? News! King of Pop the King of Boy Diddling? Next! and it goes on and on. Again, with so many outlets available, they have to prove their worth by propelling any sensational anything to the foreground whenever possible. Tonight all of them, E!, Access Hollywood, TMZ, local stations, cable outlets, the Big Three, will all try to out do each other with tributes and personal stories. Wait for it. The first one to snag an interview with another 80's icon, like Madonna, will trumpet their acquisition with previews of "an exclusive interview with (insert name of celebrity that's still alive here)."

The death of Michael Jackson just provided them with another weeks worth of justification for their own existence. At least. If it turns out he was pretty much killed by his personal doc, it will go on another six months.

I will always love Graham Parker And The Rumour's version of "I Want You Back."

Like Woody Allen, Michael Jackson crossed a line into a zone of unsavory creepiness from which you can never fully return. The best I can say is I hope he is now at peace.

I'm not a Michael Jackson hater, but the media coverge has me a little confused. It just doesn't make any logical sense to me.

People have furthered ther careers for 2 decades by making obscene Michael Jackson jokes, and now they act as if he was a saint sent by heaven because he died. So which is it?

It seems typical to me... He will be ideolized for a couple days, then the family will start to fight over his estate, and then the media and comedians will go back to making jokes at his expense.

I hadn't thought of that, Nano, but you're right. Fucking media ghouls. They hounded Jackson (or Jacko in media jackal-tongue) for absolutely everything that happened during his life, and now they're feasting off his remains. While ignoring things that will materially impact people's lives-- unless being sad about your favorite pop star dying magically gives you health insurance.

>>>iconic, pioneering and sometimes "heroic"
Yeah. Hero's a word they've managed to completely destroy.

While I found Michael to have grone more than strange over the years and the child molestation charges which I found disgusting, I can still admit that I feel a deep sense of sadness since my first introduction to the Jacksons was on the Ed Sullivan show. I grew up in the sixties and was a real fan. I'd forgotten how much music Michael continued to make. So much so, that I saw a clip on MTV today of Michael when he came to NY in 2001 after September 11th with yet another number one album, Invincible. Anyway, my childhood is slowly slipping away and it's a little tough to take righ now!

I wasn't around when Elvis died, but I'm getting an inkling of what that must have been like - I'm already sick of the wall-to-wall coverage and Michael Jackson's been dead for less than 24 hours.

I love one or two of Jackson's songs, but I was never a real fan. My main image of him has always been the reclusive weirdo he was for the last decade or so. I think his death is more of a tragedy for his fans, friends and family than for him. He was pushed insanely hard and treated like crap as a kid and denied a normal, happy childhood, which he spent most of his adult life trying desperately to reclaim with disastrous results. He had serious mental issues, and was literally never happy in his own skin.

I hope he finds the peace in death he never had in this life.

I was around when Elvis died but we didn't quite have this amount of 24 hour news coverage.. there was some but not like this is.

Yes, MJ was big in the 80's, I was never a big fan.. but then I am older so maybe that's why, my daughter was more into him, but then she grew up with MTV and I was more into CMTV...lol

I think they are going just a little over the top on it and feel they are doing a disservice to Farrah by not giving her some air time too.

It's like she didn't even exist or hasn't even died.

Like some of the others here, I grew up with Michael and the Jackson 5 (Michael is just a year older than me). I won't ramble, but suffice it to say I chose the J5 over the Osmond Brothers....

Michael turned into a freak, but I still feel deep sadness for the death of the boy/young man he once was.

Thank you for the music, Michael, RIP.

I agree that the definition of "heroic" has been destroyed by the media. I see it as a by-product of WWII. We look back on it with such nostalgia and see the actual heroics of it and yearn for something that we can also be as reverent about. As a result, we stage these monstrous memorial observations of the "heroic" dead, with flags and artificial ceremony so that we can pretend to the same sort of heroics through manufactured emotional outbursts without actually having to do anything as heroic as storming a beach while being shot at by a few thousand Germans. We idolize the military to the point that if you want to criticize any aspect of it you have to preface the remark with six sentences of "ninety-nine point nine nine nine nine percent of our heroic soldiers are doing an awesome job under difficult circumstances and deserve our support and gratitude" or you are accused of hating our troops. Again, it's all an artificial construct used to cultivate a persona as someone that is intensely something without actually having to do that thing.

But I digest.

The death of Michael Jackson is a Weapon of Mass Distraction.

My summation of all headlines for the next six months:

"This just in: Michael Jackson STILL DEAD"

"Was Jackson's death due to drug abuse??? We'll ask someone who claims to be an expert"

"Is the media covering the Michael Jackson story too much? We'll find out what YOU think"

Let's face it, this is a godsend to the cable news boys. It's a story that costs nothing to cover, for which there are thousands of "experts," and has all the scintillating sex and scandal they could ask for. Which adds up to eyeballs, eyeballs, eyeballs. The real news will get lost in the mix.

I was in my twenties when Elvis died. And all I remember was one of my heroes Groucho Marx died the same week and I was pissed of that Presley got all the media attention.

jeanette -

You were not alone. Groucho's death meant much more to me than Elvis's. I kept my television turned off for three days after Elvis's death.

Imagine what it would have been like with 3 major 24 hour "news" networks when Elvis or Lennon died.

I am sad he has died, but at the same time, I am glad he is in peace. God knows he never had it when he was alive.

Michael Jackson was a tortured soul his whole life. I enjoyed a lot of his music and I pray to God he's at peace finally.

I've had MJ music in my life my entire life. My parents were Motown fans so through them I learned the Jackson 5 playlist. My Aunt's and Uncles introduced me to the "Off The Wall" album and as an 80's kid the moonwalking gloved one captivated me until this very day. My daughter is 11 now and she too has become a fan of MJ's music.
Thanks Bob for your honesty AND for the respect you've given fans like me who in spite of all of Michael's imperfections still truly admire his musical and humanitarian contributions.

As a fan, I too am disgusted by the hypocrisy of the MSM. I'd rather THEY focus on the Health Care fight and sensational MJ drama and leave the tributes and admiration to fan websites and blogs worldwide.

In my community Michael Joseph Jackson was more than just America's 80's hitmaking wacko. We have truly lost one of our most gifted and definitely tragic geniuses. He did a helluva lotta good in impoverished communities at home and around the world. He will be missed more than a lot of people in this country realize.

Thanks Bob for this thread. I respect your honesty. Thanks for respecting me as well.

He had a myriad of problems and if he hadn't molested children then I'd feel very differently. But, honestly, I feel the same as Bob... possibly even a bit more antipathy.

And I have to agree with others in this thread that the MSM is full of shit (as usual). Suddenly he's a hero? What about all the molestation cases, the way he treats his children and the general way-out-wackiness of the guy?

And I'll join others in the thread with who I felt more for when they passed: John Belushi, Jimmy Stewart and Johnny Carson (even though everyone says he was a real bastard) being the first that come to mind.

My 2¢ . . .

I have nothing good to say about that Freak or his music, so I won't say anything except that it's a damn shame the the media orgy over his death is overshadowing even the slightest mention of Farah Fawcett's death.

I might be a little bit more upset over Michael Jackson's death if the image of blood spewing from Neda's face wasn't still fresh in my mind.

When my boys were kids we had a good friend arrested and convicted of child molestation. Since my kids were over at his house all the time playing with his kid, they were interviewed and determined to be unmolested, thank God! During that time I learned way more than I ever wanted to about child molesters, and felt a powerful sense of betrayal that a person I trusted (he was a child therapist) was using his kid as bait and buggering little boys.
I am sure Michael Jackson was just such a man, and as far as I am concerned, he is just one less creep on the streets.